Dime a Dozen #20: Hindsight is 20/20

Posted on April 16, 2013 by Jason Moore

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  1. I think you might be taking Mikey’s comments a little bit too seriously. They weren’t personal attacks at all, it was simply discussion regarding the deck as a metagame choice (how it hasn’t been making the same types of appearances). This post calling him “disgruntled” and the like seems like a continuation of public drama. Why not have a chat with Mikey instead of calling him out? That would probably end all this without you taking his comments to the presses.

  2. Hello Jason,
    If you love the white weenies deck then I’m happy for you. If you want me to play the weenie deck in daily events then show me a deck list and video content to prove the deck is 60% EV against fissure post, stompy, and affinity. Actually I have seen your content over the last year and believe your more complex than a single archetype in the format.
    I never heard of Mikey K before I read this article. What I don’t want in these issues is to drawn into personal drama. Take the higher ground and solve the problem directly, if it can be solved.
    What I do like about these articles is ideas about the current meta game. Ideas on decks that can compete in the current meta game, and video content to get an idea of the deck in action.
    Thank you for your time.

  3. Anonymous – I appreciate your comment, and respect your opinion. While I look forward to talking with Mikey personally, I don’t see anything wrong with responding to his public comments via a public forum of my own.

  4. I heard what Mikey said on the podcast, and thought he was just joking around – but putting words in someones mouth or misrepresenting them is a sure way to get a serious response (which really does rub a lot of people the wrong way, including me). Could Jason have done this privately? Sure, but he was called out publicly and it is fair that he respond in kind. Nothing on either end has been completely out of line, and this probably goes away right after Mikey reads this and they talk about it. I think it just comes down to a misunderstanding or a miscalculation of personal boundaries – It is not my intention to downplay how anyone feels either, I am just giving my two cents.

    White weenie’s problem right now is the same as any deck that is even borderline midrange – it doesn’t like having all it’s permanents returned to hand, and it is far from being alone here. I was really excited to see what would come from white weenie to combat the post decks, but did not foresee the rise of Temporal Fissure (and many did). White always seems to have the tools available somewhere, but this nut is tough to crack.

    Thanks for all the content, and please keep up the great work! I accidentally spent 30 minutes watching r4 of your 4-0 daily, and it is hard to imagine a time that there was a mono-blue deck that didn’t have posts or faeries (especially since it wasn’t that long ago).

  5. wyldcat – Hi! I’d like you to play whatever deck you enjoy playing. I’ve never made any claims that I could prove White Weenie’s % EV. Does any deck in Pauper have an objective, easily measurable % EV? A lot of variables like decklists, familiarity and skill factor in. I appreciate your input, and I hope you’ll continue supporting my articles!

  6. Hooligurn2 – Solid points all around. One of my favorite things about MUC previously was the tools it had against Grapeshot/Empty Storm (Piracy Charm/Delver/Echoing Truth/Dispel/Hydroblast etc.), but that is of course not relevant anymore. Looking forward to hearing more of your feedback in the future.

  7. Why is he called ‘Mikey K’ anyway? He sounds like a Boston drug dealer or something…

  8. I used to listen to Pauper to the People, but the show just really put me off over time. I think this Mikey K thing is a representative example of a larger attitude problem with the show.

  9. lol – Could just be his nickname. Not sure.

    Ramela – I’m not sure what you mean by that. The other members I’ve interacted with have been rather agreeable.

  10. Hey Jason,

    glad you finally put the UB Teachings deck on an article, this is my fav pure control deck by far. It would be great to see videos and comments on some tweakings. Also, wouldn’t you put in chittering rats?

    Regarding Mikey’s controversy, just saying that I have played and chatted with him sometimes, and he seemed to me a cool guy and polite person. Hope you guys settle your disputes.

    The Arena: I would love to see delver blue vs simic post, although I understand you’ll like to change both decks from the last arena article. The intensive sideboarding analysis was great on it.

    Theory-centric articles would be very appreciated, since I feel that information is which makes grew up my MTG level.

    Thanks a lot!

  11. Vermiis – Nice to hear from you! I’d like to put together some Teachings videos sometime. So far I haven’t felt like Chittering Rats have been needed. All of your suggestions are awesome! Hope to hear from you again.

  12. Mikey K decided to leave magic forever because of this article. He could not bear with the shame and the guilt. We posted his video comment on Pauper Revolution on facebook.

  13. thanks for the shout out and glad you’re enjoying the deck.. I’m a big fan of it, but unfortunately I think it has a tough match against Fissure which is running wild

  14. @ Samuel Kalkin

    Lol I thought you were kidding. he really did… he quit magic. Geez………………………..

  15. As a fan of yours and a fan of Mikey K I have to say that you are coming across as someone who got your shoes made fun of. I don’t see how any of the cited comments are an insult towards you, more White Weenie. I could say you’re guilty of not letting the White Button Up w/ Black Tie thing die, but is that insulting you? Hardly (as a side note: White shirt / Black tie is great). I really believe you took his comments personally when, perhaps, you shouldn’t have. Keep up the good work and I look forward to your content in the future!

  16. If MikeyK wanted to be taken seriosly he wouldn’t have acted like such a baby by quitting. He’s done it before (quit that is) and came back so I fully expect him to come back this time, but I hope not. Stay away from the podcast Mikey, I’m sure they’re (Chirs/Nate) as tired of being interupted by you as I am hearing it.

  17. Jason your doing a great job with all the pauper content you put out. I really like when you do an article and have video content to back it up. I enjoy magic so much that I have no problem watching a 30 min video about a deck that I just got through reading about. The video’s are a great teaching tool that I enjoy watching. So please keep them coming. As for White Weenie needing to be put to bed ..I totally think you should talk all you want about it. For the New player getting into pauper WW is affordable and can be an entry deck into the format that you love. I myself love MBC even if it’s struggling in the format in DE’s. Long Live WW and MBC. Thanx again for all that you do for the pauper community.

  18. Samuel Kalkin – I will try to check out the comment you’re talking about.

    JustSin – No problem!

    Kainius – I appreciate you sharing your perspective. What would you have done instead?

    Anonymous – No need to be hostile about things…

  20. I had no idea people took Pauper so seriously. I thought it was kind of a casual format. I first found out about it from Mikey K, but he always came off as kind of a tool. I think a lot of Magic players are like that though. Unfortunatly people forget it is a game and the most important thing is to have fun. This is why I have all but quit Magic, people are too competitive.

  21. Anonymous – Perhaps you can find some more casual formats to participate in one day. In my opinion there is still a lot of casual Pauper to be enjoyed. Good luck!

  22. public drama may generate good page hits and comments, but I would have thought that whole section is what editors are for. I don’t care what the merits are as far as the specifics go, that stuff belonged in a private email not a public article. “but he did it first” is a good excuse for primary school kids…

  23. PB – I appreciate the comment. You’re welcome to believe I’m making excuses, but I take responsibility for deciding to speak about Mikey K publicly. Why are you bothered by this being public? Just curious.

  25. Evidently Mikey thinks you said some very hurtful things and he quit Magic. Wow, what a baby. Jason, I have no issue with you calling him out. Sounds like he needed to hear it.

  26. Mustang_aj – I listened to “What’s Beef” before writing this.

    Anonymous – That’s what I’ve been hearing. I find it strange that he would quit the game based on what I’ve said in this article (just my opinion). No need for personal attacks or bashing to ensue though.

  27. Don’t you think it’s a bit hypocritical to “call someone out” publicly for saying public comments about you? I don’t see why you wouldn’t just be the “bigger man” per se and tell him to knock off his comments privately. This article is doing exactly the same thing that you felt he did. This is just baiting pageviews by playing up public drama. It’s painfully obvious that his comments are joking if you actually listen to the podcast and have no malicious intent.

  28. @Jason: He didn’t quit because of what you said, it’s been a long time running. And it’s strange that you don’t promote bashing in the comment section when that was the purpose of the section in that article.

  29. Anonymous – Personally I don’t think it’s hypocritical. I’m not sure how well you know Mikey K, but the fact of the matter is that there are a number of things he’s said to other people in the past that I don’t agree with. This just happens to be the issue I decided to bring up. Doing what I “felt he did” is sort of the point. I don’t know if you are implying that I didn’t “actually listen” to the podcast, but either way you’re welcome to your opinion. I happen to disagree that it was an obvious joke, and even if someone is joking, do you feel they have the right to say whatever they want? Also, if he was obvious joking, why do you think Chris felt the need to make his “not an island” response? Chris knows Mikey better than you or I do. This is all just my opinion. I appreciate your input, and thanks for commenting.

  30. Anonymous – Yes, I called him out for some things he said. That doesn’t mean I think people from all over should start writing comments bashing him.

  31. Jason:

    I’m confused how it is not hypocritical to call someone out publicly for their public comments. If you were hurt by them, the response isn’t just to go to the presses, you should resolve it like real men.

    And you haven’t responded to how this is an obvious plow to generate pageviews. You drummed this up to engage people in public drama, and that’s NOT something that is beneficial for the format. It would be like channel fireball, instead of making an official statement, calling TSG a gambling addict and a “disgruntled” magic player who stole a bunch of cards. Obviously that would generate pageviews but the community would feel hurt.

    Furthermore, he didn’t attack you personally. He didn’t call you a jerk, he didn’t PERSONALLY attack you. He simply said that you wouldn’t let WW die. He never used racial, homophobic, sexist, or any other sort of epithets. So I’m confused why you would be so offended over an obvious joke.

    I still find it amusing that you denounce bashing in the comment section when the whole section of the article was bashing Mikey.

  33. Anonymous – Once again, just because I called someone out for comments they made that involve me doesn’t mean I think other people should start to gang up on the person and call them names. Hope that makes sense.

  35. Anonymous – I’ve been trying to respond to everyone’s comments (which is not required of me, nor is it practiced by a large number of writers). It’s a little difficult to determine who I am talking to with so many people posting as “Anonymous” – If you are the same person who wrote the previous (longer) posts, you seem very set in your ways and I don’t see how anything I say will change your mind. I appreciate the fact that you are sharing your opinion.

  36. I honestly can’t see why anyone would be so offended by what Mikey K said. I can, however, see how it would be hurtful to having a big section in an article devoted to you in a negative way.

    Jason: to me it looks like he made a crack at your deck and that you just destroyed him completely. :-(

  37. Is this to be our own little donglegate?

    http://techcrunch.com/2013/03/21/a-dongle-joke-that-spiraled-way-out-of-control/

    Seriously, though, calling someone out in public is almost always more about creating drama and gaining social validation than it is about actually trying to reach a resolution. If you have issues with someone, either work it out with them through private channels or ignore them. I think the adage goes something like: “Don’t feed the trolls.”

    Of the magic-related topics, I’m most interested in deck analysis and I like the arena idea. Keep up the good work!

  38. hiveking – With all due respect I’m not sure that you were reading what I wrote closely enough. If you have time, please read the section again. I don’t think I ever claimed that the statements he made themselves were objectively or overtly offensive. Note how I tried to make it clear that everyone is welcome to their own opinion (just as you or I am), and that his opinion of WW has very little to do with why I was disappointed in him. The main thing is that he and I were chatting constantly while he was making these comments. I was always the person initiating conversations and trying to further develop a rapport between our podcasts. We were even discussing my article, and he never told me that he was saying things about it publicly on his show. Do you understand how this could rub someone the wrong way when they are already making an effort to become friendly with someone else? If you disagree and still feel the way you feel, that’s fine. I would like to know what I’ve said/why you feel that I’ve “destroyed” his character though. Thanks in advance.

    ahniwa – I appreciate the feedback.

  39. Moore:
    Isn’t a part of being friendly with someone sharing a laugh with them?

  41. Thanks to everyone for the comments. If you’d like a reply, please refrain from using “Anonymous” as your handle. That way I can identify what comments are coming from whom.

  42. Great read Jason, and I loved the link going back to the Fundamental Turn article. It was a great read as well. I rather enjoy reading your deck analysis of various decks. It gives great insight into what needs to be done to defeat said decks, and how to effectively do so. Please keep those coming.

    I’d also love to read/hear your input (plug for @PaupersCage) on new sets and what cards they bring to the Pauper table.

    As a relatively new player to pauper the more information you can give, the more enjoyable I see this experience being.

  44. @Jason Moore – It seemed like he may have been kidding so I would have returned the jest….or more likely challenged him to a for fun, Pauper Death Match 3000, had some laughs and both of us could have shared the vids on our respective sites. Problem is, he is a curmudgeon and his jokes seem serious…so I don’t blame you for your response. I wouldn’t let it bother you. Smile and enjoy the community you have here, as we enjoy having you here as well!

  46. Just let it go already. You both overreacted. There is no right side here.

    I enjoy the PTTP podcasts quite a bit, they were the 1st pauper podcasts I listened to and were the reason I chose to play pauper. I watched a lot of MikeyK videos early on to learn the fprmat and I thank him for that.

    I began listening to Paupers Cage a few episodes in and also greatly enjoy them as well. Very insigtful and some really indepth analysis into the meta as well the deck breakdowns.

    My plug for standard pauper ~ I would like to see more time dedicated to this format. Look at the Gatherling tournaments for more info if you need to.It’s a great format and deservers more podcast time.

  48. A few points…
    Firstly – thank you for your ongoing support of the best format ever.
    Second – whoever wrote this:
    “…..In fact, I’ll give you an example of someone who should be called out:
    http://www.mtgoacademy.com/dime-a-dozen-18-a-miniature-pauper-survival-guide/
    In the comments section, deluxeicoff obviously is bashing your creation, not even trying to appear like he is joking. That is something toxic that you can “call out”, not even claiming to be joking….”
    - is in need of either
    A) “Obviously” Therapy for split personality disorder…
    B) A Reality check
    I read what I wrote…how is that IN ANY WAY ‘bashing’?!?! Deck disagreements happen, hell…they probably happen 120 times /deck given two pilots/creators and a 60 card list…In my expert opinion, your generalizations were vastly overrated.
    Thirdly @ greater mtgoacademy audience – it’s sad this ‘pauper soap opera’ is diverting even an electron of collective energy…but I’m ignorant of any facts here…I’ve never listened to one of these podcasts…just my opinion.
    Fourthly @ Jason – rise above dude. You don’t like me and that’s fine. You’ve even gone as far as to say you’ll never reply to me… Just please understand my position…it’s hard for someone like me to respect the opinion of someone like you. What do I mean by this?
    Well, the last daily event I played in was 2 hours ago…the last one you competed in was in September 2012….(http://mtgstats.com/PlayerDetail.aspx?PlayerID=53607)
    When I see your observations on a Pauper format you claim to be an ‘active member’ of…it’s simply off base, your claims are IMMEDIATLY invalid since you rarely put your ‘money where your mouth is…” In a perfect world, the prerequisite for an article would be expertise in said format….at the very least, a recent showing of said ‘Tech’.
    Please don’t react defensively to this…although I assume you will. Instead, do what your readers should expect: Represent. Show up at a daily every few MONTHS and let’s see where the cards fall.

  49. I have talked to Mike and there’s other things going on than has helped him come to this decision and as one of his friends I will not go into it but he needs a long break from MtG. Our staff at PTTP tries every week to bring you all the content you want so please let us know if you would like us to go more in depth on subject matter pertaining to the format.

  50. I haven’t read through all the comments, so I believe I am not the only one to say this. Calling out MikeyK in this article is a lame act. Totally uncalled for. The way he talked crap about white weenie was funny. What you did here was just plain mean.

  51. nyukon – We appreciate the update.

    GusDragon – Anyone is welcome to talk however they want about WW. If you have time, let me know what parts you thought were mean. Your input is appreciated.

  52. @deluxeicoff – While the jerk in me loves fanning the flames to some degree, please remember that DE results that you can cite as a reference are not in any way indicative of all of the Magic Online events that a player participates in. Should you happen to peruse Jason’s older content (http://www.mtgoacademy.com/author/jason-moore/), you will see that he has played in DEs that have occurred between the one you cite and the present. Also, he makes content for Blackborder that you can view and add to your research. Even with this information, there are also other events that occur each day that you will (probably) never be able to view. Also, players aren’t listed if they have a 2-2 record or worse.

  53. I’m the person who has been posting the longer comments in this thead

    @deluxe
    In that comment, it wasn’t a critical deck disagreement. You didn’t even make an attempt to be nice or provide constructive criticism. You merely quoted him and put “lol” next to it. That’s not professional at all. You don’t even make an attempt to seem like you are joking. That kind of behavior is not conductive to a positive community.

    @jason
    The most hurtful parts are when you call Mikey “disgruntled” and say things on your twitter that he needs to be destroyed. He was joking. You look like a jerk when you post things like this. Brad Nelson doesn’t post publicly about the “#beefs” he has with other people, he does it privately so as to not cause negative vibes in the community. Your overuse of hash tags is not only amusing but wreaks of childish abandon

  54. Anon – It’s pretty clear that there are several aspects of my personality that you are not a fan of. I am not going to change anytime soon, so why not do something more constructive with your time? You’ve shared plenty of your views in this thread, and you’re welcome to continue, but what does it accomplish? I could try to change your mind or get to see things from a different perspective other than the one you’ve chosen, but at the end of the day you’re welcome to think what you want. Take care.

  55. I think anyone who has ever spent time listening to mikey knows that he can be a bit abrasive, and that he often plays that up for comedic effect. That said, I also acknowledge the fact that the stuff he says can come across as hostile at times if it’s not clear that he is trying to be funny.

    I can absolutely understand how you could take a series of comments the wrong way, and then be further offended because if felt like it was a slight made behind your back. Reading this as a disinterested third party, it does not seem that mikey intended it as such.

    What I can’t as easily understand is why you felt that you needed to make a big public thing of it.

    I think I can best sum up my concerns as a question.

    What value do you think your readers are going to get from a half a page of writing about a conflict between you and mikey? Does that seem like something that’s going to be a good use of their time, or is instead an issue that mostly just has significance to you?

  56. longtimegone – It’s a bit of both. All of my content is optional viewing/reading/listening, and anyone can skip over something they don’t want to spend time on. Ideally I’d like to give people the option of being as informed as possible, which is the same reason why I promote Mikey K and his content in the latest episode of Pauper’s Cage. I hope you’ll continue to enjoy my free content, and I appreciate your comment!

  57. To Jason:

    I completely agree that public statements (such from MikeyK) are most certainly subject for critical analysis in the public forum. If this were not the case, there would be no accountability, and therefore no pursuit of a higher standard of conduct. However, having listened to Mikey’s contributions for about 2 years, I’ve come to learn that he is a very sarcastic person and can come across as mean spirited, even if that’s not his intention. I do believe Mikey is one of the best players (and content providers) in the pauper community, and because of this, he needs to be above reproach when it comes to making public statements. How he has even treated some of his co-hosts in the past (even if it was in abrasive fun) was very demeaning, and reflects his public image. Granted, Mikey has gotten much better over the past year or so (much less rage!), but he needs to keep on the humble path if he wishes to gain credibility.

    Jason, you are a great magic player and gentlemen. I hope you can resolve this issue with MikeyK.

  59. I love your articles dude, keep them coming, I am a big fan. I especially love the video’s, you have a way making them engaging. I personally think the WW stuff is great and never tire of it, I’ve been playing WW since like 1996 in several different formats, its a fundamental mtg archetype. I really hope that BS doesnt stop you from continuing to cover the archetype in pauper.

    Keep speaking your mind…though it’s a shame the focus got taken away from the rest of the article, I especially loved the revisiting of that epic 35-3 comeback with mono U vs aura’s.

  61. hey! wanted to say Ive enjoyed the content of yours Ive gotten to see recently. Ive only just started playing pauper and am thoroughly enjoying mono blue fae(delver blue w/e).

    after playing some matches against temporal fissure post decks recently, ive found myself able to win even after they resolve fissure. unless they can storm off enough to literally bounce everything, then ive been finding that my creatures and spells are cheap enough to sometimes recover. just thought Id mention that, I know the first time i saw temporal fissure resolve i thought for sure I should just scoop, but decided to play it out, and surprisingly still handily won.

    as far as the mikey K thing goes, Ive listened to alot of PTTP and enjoy both of yalls content. I agree that Magic is a game first and foremost, and the pauper community should try its best to stick together. dont let all the haters in the comments get you down, and I hope any disputes get solved amicably.

    suggestions for the arena: Delver blue vs. affinity. I know personally in this match up Ive tried some different sideboarding options and continues to be unsatisfied with my ability to both counter atog and not die from frogmites and myr enforcers to the face (currently my SB for affinity is 4 hydroblast, 2 steel sabotage, and up to 3 coral nets depending). also, the affinity decks with auriok sunchaser are f’in scary.

    once again thanks for all the great content!

    -MonsterZero

  62. Monster – Great observations! It’s very cool of you to support me. I had a similar experience with Delver vs. FissurePost, and as far as The Arena goes, Delver vs. Affinity sounds great. I’m going to try and make that happen!