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Let’s Play Magic Online: MVW & TSE
Posted on October 11, 2012 by ChrisKool and PlanetWalls
ChrisKool and PlanetWalls Chris and A.J. have been playing for a long, long time and are both staff members of MTGO Academy. Their favorite format is 100 Card Singleton.
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Of all the mtgoa content, I have to say you guys set the scale by far the lowest.
It has no comedic value like LRR has, it has no educational value like simons or marshalls.
It is just alot of shouting, eating noises, and random picks motivated by “ooohw that card has a shiny thingie”.
At least try to get some kind of identity, now you are just a proper mishap of Laurel and Hardy with sound.
yay drawfing marvellite!
The internet has completely buried the concept of, “If you don’t have something nice to say, don’t say anything at all.”
I look forward to your content, so I will offer my opinion as a counter-balance. I think you guys are fun to listen to, you are fine as drafters and players, and I always learn something while watching you guys.
“It is just alot of shouting, eating noises, and random picks motivated by ‘ooohw that card has a shiny thingie.’”
BAM! Kick it up a notch.
Fluxx: In all seriousness, this content submission is admittedly weak. What oftentimes will be the case with Let’s Play MTGO is that we have to fill a hole in the Academy content schedule after a busy day of work, and squeeze the production into a minimal time window. This is not ideal, and I want you to know that your criticism is noted and taken seriously.
With that being said, I’m not sure I agree a priori that eating during videos is bad, or that talking about goofy old card art is simply being attracted by shiny things. The idea, unsuccessful here I would say, is to set a certain casual tone, but the remaining production value, as you note, does not justify it in this particular case.
neckbeard & monkey: With all that I say above, I’m glad you guys tune in, and know that we’re going to make efforts to make our content more regularly and ideally with more of a plan (probably some Constructed if we want to be educational, and Limited when we think something casual is appropriate).
I personally find these enjoyable, if maybe in a different way than other videos. The situations you find yourself in have more of an unwanted entertainment value than the “let’s do something funny”-attitude of LRR. To me this is more of a “let’s see what they did this time”, looking over your shoulders thing. Eating during videos is in fact bad, but lots of Licid action makes up for it.
As you mentioned constructed, do you think there is any way to set up a synchronized recording of you playing against each other while skyping? I’m thinking one audio stream, but two recordings edited to show both the hand at the bottom as well as the top. Maybe that’s unreasonably hard to do, but I would love to hear you banter while playing some obscure vintage matchup.
First of all, don’t let Fluxx get you guys down. You aren’t close to as bad as LRR!
That said, I don’t usually watch this series because I mostly don’t enjoy two person vids.* But given the content void while we wait for RTR to prerelease and my love for retro drafts I was going to check this out this week. But after reading the intro blurb (and the comments about eating) I just can’t bring myself to hit play….
OK I lied. I figured not watching any of these vids while providing the below criticism would be unfair, so I’m partway through listening to your Mirage draft. But, really – that intro paragraph is just a deterrent that you don’t need to include.
* Watching two people play is usually ok (though still worse than one person IMO). But watching two people draft is just the worst. The only way it works is when one person is clearly in charge of the draft and the other person can play devils advocate, (some of LSV’s old vids with Riki/TSG) or play the part of the ‘viewer’ and preemptively ask questions that allow the draft to expand on their ideas (Marshall did this to perfection back in the old Limited resources days). Watching two people draft who are arguing over the direction the draft should go or could have gone just isn’t entertaining to me. In this draft that negative aspect is probably exacerbated by the fact that neither of you are familiar enough with the formats to really take the ‘lead’ … but its been a problem in the other “Lets draft magic online” editions I have watched as well. Hopefully you guys take this criticism in the spirit it is meant.
Simon: You wrote, “The situations you find yourself in have more of an unwanted entertainment value than the “let’s do something funny”-attitude of LRR.” This is exactly the sort of thing that we found we enjoyed the most about our series early on. What we enjoy the most is, e.g., dealing with a draft that’s already going to hell, or fighting back with little time on the clock. You can find us pull ourselves out of a horrible situation after crossing our fingers with a White Sun’s Zenith during a Scars Block draft in this old video: http://www.mtgoacademy.com/the-stupidly-named-limited-series-nms-2/
(Note that our old video player works strangely on some browsers, but downloading the vids should still be available if anyone is interested.)
As for constructed, we did something like what you’re saying in these videos (with the 100-Card Singleton format):
http://www.mtgoacademy.com/lets-play-magic-online-100-card-singleton-and-masques-draft/
http://www.mtgoacademy.com/lets-play-more-masques-and-100-card-singleton/
We had originally intended on recording in the same room and with only one audio track but realized it would be impossible to discuss our decision-making on camera without informing each other of our plans. If we were gearing more toward entertainment than strategy (probably a good idea for us), this wouldn’t be as big of a problem. You might see us try this with the Classic format shortly.
Robin: Thanks for the note; you make a good point about the pilot and observer relationship. As you’ve probably discovered, of the two of us, I’m the much less risk-averse player and drafter, which I think sets up a good dynamic, but per your point, the decision-making itself shouldn’t be disrupted by differences in player personality. It can be distracting and unhelpful to see two people dispute every move during the drafting phase, and much better to hear discussion from two people about the strengths and potential pitfalls of certain decisions without as much disagreement.
But the question stands: Would you have taken the Phyrexian Purge?
You guys are just not a very good team. Wallis sounds like he’s on the moon, oftentimes his comments come late or not at all in time for the pick. Your analysis boils down to one or two cards and you overlook half of a pack. You constantly contradict each other, whenever there is about to be some form of consensus on the best card someone chimes in on something else.
“So we’re taking the Pacifism?” “Gallantry is also good, it’s like a Pacifism but you get to draw a card *smack, smack*” “Uhh, kind of.”
“Lowland Giant?” “I like dudes!” “Yeah, me too!” “Am I right in thinking that {Random card} is a removal spell?” “It’s kind of a removal spell.” “I think we should take it, ha!”
Figure out what your deck needs, then draft accordingly. Stop being different just to be different.
Now of course you guys need to do an entire series where you’re only talking with your mouths full of crackers.
I enjoy and appreciate the content you bring to the game. Thanks for taking the time to record and produce the videos.
And Fluxx,
Here’s a link to BBExpress, a free video recorder: http://www.bbsoftware.co.uk/
And here’s a link to Audacity, a free audio recorder: audacity.sourceforge.net/
And finally, here’s a place to put your videos up for free: http://www.youtube.com
So, if you think you can do it better, put up or shut up. Constructive criticism is one thing, but being a jerk because of anonymity is another. But maybe if you complain loud enough, they’ll refund the money you paid to get this content.
-Chris
Host, Pauper to the People
MTGCast.com
Hi Chris. Your podcast is good. I remember talking about it with you in the past.
I would like to say, though, that there was some legitimacy to Fluxx’s statement. I appreciate the defense, but it’s really not necessary. These comments are here for people to sound off in any (appropriate) way they want.
My response seemed to have caused more stirring then I expected, so I find myself obligated to reply a second time.
First of all to Chris, since it is the strongest and most direct.
If I didnt care about this show or website I wouldnt have commented, giving negative feedback is not being a ‘jerk’, there is only so much room to give positive feedback in a simple reply. Anonomity is an old argument, but non-relevant. I have been using this handle for 14 years now everywhere on the internet (or Fluxje), and will be using this handle for all the years to come.
In fact I used the ‘fluxje’ handle for my youtube channel, I have been a commentator myself in the past for SCBW about 4 years ago. Not only that but I will take you up on your offer, and make a RTR draft video next week.
Now for the content itself:
The biggest problem lies in you two dualcasting. For a dualcast to be succesfull, you need to adherit to ONE very important rule. There has to be a host, and a guest (even if that gues always returns). Talkshows and debates are setup like this for a reason.
The host is there to direct the draft, the conversations, and have the strength of will to cut the conversation when needed. The guest is there to give insight, feedback, or a fresh perspective.
Right now you two dont supplement eachother, nor do you guys bring out good debates.
The best example is the start of the Tempest draft. You guys overlook half the pack, including the rare. The rare in fact is a complete bomb in limited. Rolling thunder might be the pick still over coffer queen, but at least discuss it. Same goes with p2-5, and the evaluation of the cards.
Now eating is a complete nogo. If you want to eat, do it during intermissions, or one of you walk away to get a quick bite.
Bubsy made a perfect example what is wrong with this series, and the series you guys brought out before. I can faintly remember a SoM/NP draft where a woman accompanied you. The only thing that stuck with me about that draft was it contained an orgy of voices, and me turning it off after 7 minutes.
Sorry for my outburst guys. I took a difficult day at work and carried it home with me.
And Fluxx, you post up that RtR video, I’ll be first in line to watch it.
Tomorrow you’ll find Chris and me playing Classic matches separately. I don’t know why I was so scared that I chose not to block the Solifuge.
For the record: I would have taken Phyrexian Purge. This format has very few opportunities for true card advantage and killing even two creatures is usually worth 6 life (even if is a dead card in some life or death situations) and plague wind from 4 mana and 9-12 life often still wins the game despite the steep toll on your life total.